Links

Join

Forums

Find Help

Recovery Readings

Spiritual Meditations

Chat

Contact


Go Back   Bluidkiti's Alcohol and Drug Addictions Recovery Help/Support Forums > Lounge > General Forum
Register FAQ Community Calendar Arcade Today's Posts Search Chat Room

Share This Forum!  
 
        

General Forum A place to share about everything else.

Post New ThreadReply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-27-2013, 12:42 AM   #1
MajestyJo
Super Moderator
 
MajestyJo's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Hamilton, ON
Posts: 25,078
Default AA CHRISTMAS STORY

AA Christmas Story

Uptight Before Christmas
(To the rhyme of Twas the Night Before Christmas)

Uptight before Christmas, all through these rooms alcoholics were stricken with holiday gloom.

They prayed, "Santa, please make us happy, joyous & free, bring us candy and presents and serenity."

Greed filled their minds and envy their hearts and someone said, "It's time for the meeting to start!"

"Does anyone have a topic for discussion tonight?" Every face in the place turned wintery white!

They lost all self-seeking, self-pity and self-will when down through the chimney came the ghost of St. Bill!

He chuckled and said as he sat himself down "Call the White House and tell 'em there's a new Dubya in town."

Then he looked through a big book and said with a tear, "Wow! No one rewrote this after all these years! "

Clean house, help your neighbor, be loving and kind, and don't take the first drink one day at a time."

"How could a message as simple as this be realized, analyzed and intellectually dismissed?"

There lies the reason this ghost has arrived: to re-give a gift that has saved all your lives!

Then he set up a big screen and a DVD so every lost soul in the meeting could see.

He played a movie of drunks at their best and their worst, what is and what was when blessed and cursed.

There were scenes of a housewife passed out at a bar, a respectable businessman wrecking his car,

a fight in a kitchen, a fight in bed, a fight at a reception between newlyweds.

An empty bottle, a desperate man alone in a motel with a gun in his hands.

He puts down the gun and picks up the phone and whimpers and blubbers, "Honey, let me come home."

She hangs up as she tells him, "Don't call here anymore." He reaches for the phone book and falls to the floor.

Somehow that phone book seems to capture his gaze: it's open to a number under the A's.

Then all of the people in the movie converged on the poor side of town in the basement of a church.

Driven together in a willing herd to hear of hope and deliver the word.

The ghost of Bill W. turned off the TV and said, "The first word of the first step is 'we'.

I suggest you start there and see where you go. Be thorough and fearless, and please-take it slow!

Let faith set the tone, let love make the mood 'and as for a topic... how about gratitude?'

Just don't drink, go to meetings and pray and be glad you're alive and sober today.

Be a good woman, be a good man and be of service whenever you can.

Be a good mother, be a good dad and try to be good to your kids when they're bad.

Be a good husband, be a good wife....... Merry Christmas to all, and to all a good life!"

Received with thanks from my friend Brenda

Christmas is so commercialized, we need to remember the reason for the season. Is putting ourselves in dept a spiritual act. The simple things in life that come from the heart have much more worth and have greater value.


The same with Thanksgiving, it is my honest opinion, it should be an all year celebration.

__________________

Love always,

Jo

I share because I care.


MajestyJo is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 12-01-2013, 04:27 PM   #2
MajestyJo
Super Moderator
 
MajestyJo's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Hamilton, ON
Posts: 25,078
Default

DWI At Christmas


On the last day before Christmas, I hurried to go to the supermarket to buy the gifts I didn't manage to buy earlier.

When I saw all the people there, I started to complain to myself:

'It is going to take forever here and I still have so many other places to go...'

Christmas really is getting more and more annoying every year.

How I wish I could just lie down, go to sleep and only wake up after it was over.

I started to curse the prices, wondering if kids really play with such expensive toys.

While looking in the toy section, I noticed a small boy of about 5 years old
pressing a doll against his chest.

He kept on touching the hair of the doll and looked so sad.

I wondered who this doll was for.

Then the little boy turned to the old woman next to him:

'Granny, are you sure I don't have enough money?'

The old lady replied: 'You know that you don't have enough money to buy this doll, my dear.'

Then she asked him to stay here for 5 minutes while she went to look around.
She left quickly. The little boy was still holding the doll in his hand.

Finally, I started to walk towards him and asked who he wanted to give this doll to.

'It is the doll that my sister loved most and wanted so much for this Christmas.

She was so sure that Santa Claus would bring it to her.'

I replied to him that maybe Santa Claus will bring it to her, after all, and not to worry.

But he replied to me sadly. 'No, Santa Claus can not bring it to her where she is now.

I have to give the doll to my mother so that she can give it to her when she goes there.'

His eyes were so sad while saying this. 'My sister has gone to be with God.

Daddy say that Mummy will also go to see God very soon, so I thought that she could bring the doll with her to give it to my sister'.

My heart nearly stopped.

The little boy looked up at me and said: 'I told daddy to tell mummy not to go yet.

I asked him to wait until I come back from the supermarket.'

Then he showed me a very nice photo of him where he was laughing.

He then told me: 'I also want mummy to take this photo with her so that she will not forget me.'

'I love my mummy and I wish she doesn't have to leave me but daddy says that she has to go to be with my little sister'

Then he looked again at the doll with sad eyes, very quietly.

I quickly reached for my wallet and took a few bills and said to the boy.

"What if we checked again, just in case if you have enough money?'

'Ok' he said. 'I hope that I have enough.'

I added some of my money to his without him seeing and we started to count it.

There was enough for the doll, and even some spare money.

The little boy said: 'Thank you God for giving me enough money' then he looked at me and added:

'I asked yesterday before I slept for God to make sure I have enough money
to buy this doll so that mummy can give it to my sister He heard me'

'I also wanted to have enough money to buy a white rose for my mummy, but I didn't dare to ask God too much.

But He gave me enough to buy the doll and the white rose.'

'You know, my mummy loves white roses.'

A few minutes later, the old lady came again and I left with my trolley.

I finished my shopping in a totally different state from when I started.

I couldn't get the little boy out of my mind.

Then I remembered a local newspaper article 2 days ago, which mentioned of a drunk man in a truck who hit a car where there was one young lady and a little girl.

The little girl died right away, and the mother was left in a critical state.

The family had to decide whether to pull the plug on the life-assisting machine, because the young lady would not be able to get out of the coma.

Was this the family of the little boy?

Two days after this encounter with the little boy in mind, I read in the newspaper that the young lady had passed away. I couldn't stop myself and went to buy a bunch of white roses and I went to the mortuary where the body of the young woman was exposed for people to see and make last wishes before burial.

She was there, in her coffin, holding a beautiful white rose in her hand with the photo of the little boy and the doll placed over her chest.

I left the place crying, feeling that my life had been changed forever.

The love that this little boy had for his mother and his sister is still, to that day, hard to imagine. And in a fraction of a second, a drunk man had taken all this away from him.

If you share this message, maybe you will help prevent someone who is drunk from going out driving.

FRIENDS ARE LIKE ANGELS, WHO HELP US FLY WHEN OUR WINGS HAVE FORGOTTEN HOW TO FLY-Russet



Originally posted on my site Jo's Kitchen
__________________

Love always,

Jo

I share because I care.


MajestyJo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2013, 04:31 PM   #3
MajestyJo
Super Moderator
 
MajestyJo's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Hamilton, ON
Posts: 25,078
Default

Symbols of the Christmas Season




Have you ever wondered where the traditions we have at Christmas time came from? I have, and in my travels and research, here are the answers that I found! I hope you enjoy reading about them as much as I have, and that you might learn something new about the Christmas season!


Christmas Stockings

tradition comes from a Christmas story of St Nicholas. In the 1800's, when the father of three young maidens could not afford a dowry for his daughters to be married. From his castle, St Nicholas heard of the poor misfortune of the maidens and secretly threw a bag of coins down their chimney. It is said that the gold coins landed in the girls stockings that were hanging in the fireplace to dry.

Later children in Holland would leave out their wooden shoes in hopes that St Nicholas would fill them with goodies.

Christmas wreaths

Christmas wreaths combine two symbols of everlasting life. The evergreen bough, that stays green all winter and a continuous unbroken circular shape.


Santa Claus

The real Santa Claus was Saint Nicholas a fourth century Bishop in Turkey. Famous for acts of kindness, especially towards children, he eventually became popular in Holland, where he was known as "Sinter Klaas". Around 1870, the Americans turned the name into Santa Claus.

In nineteenth century Britain the Elizabethan character Father Christmas - the jolly old man imagined to provide the Christmas feast - merged with Santa.

Up to 1890, he was sometimes depicted as tall and thin, wearing green or brown as often as red. Santa's present appearance was created by Swedish artist Jenny Nystrom in a series of Christmas cards. Fellow Swede Haddon Sundblom helped universalise the new image when he adopted Nystrom's ideas for Coca-Cola's advertising campaign - Santa matched Coke's red-and-white logo. Sundblom also refined the character, making his body a little fatter and giving him his herd of flying reindeer.

The idea of Santa Claus entering people's homes by dropping down the chimney comes from American Scholar Clement Moore's famous 1822 poem A Visit from St Nicholas.

Christmas Cards

Sir Henry Cole, a publisher and innovator who founded London's Victoria & Albert museum and was influential in setting up the Royal College of Music, the Albert Hall and public lavatories, sent out the first Christmas card in 1843. But the cards, at first handmade and very expensive at a shilling each did not become popular until later in the century.



Christmas Crackers


Tom Smith, a confectioner in London started to develop Christmas crackers in the 1840's. They began as individually wrapped lollies, like the ones Tom had seen on sale in Paris. Then Chinese fortune cookies gave him the idea of putting a love motto in the wrapping.

Some years later, watching a log crackling in the fire, he had the further idea of adding a crack. Tom's cracking sweets, called cosaques, appeared in 1870.

He later swapped the sweets for metal charms, and by 1900, an annual 13 million Christmas crackers were sold worldwide. Today the Tom Smith Group produces 50 million crackers a year.



Christmas Lights


In the early seventeenth century, Germans began bringing trees indoors at Christmas and decorating them with candles. It was the German Prince Albert who popularised the Christmas tree in Britain after putting one up at Windsor Castle in 1840. Over the next 20 years, candlelit trees became popular, the lights symbolising rebirth.

In 1882 the first electrically lit Christmas tree was set up in the New York home of a friend of the inventor Thomas Edison; it had 80 bulbs and cost a small fortune. Even when strings of lights were produced commercially in 1903, they cost an average American's weekly wage.

The Christmas Fairy/Angel



The fairy at the top of the Christmas tree was originally a little figure of the baby Jesus. In late seventeenth century Germany this became a shining angel. Windsor Castle's Christmas trees were topped by a large angel.

In Victorian Britain, little girls would take the angel down after Christmas and dress him in dolls' clothes. Eventually the angel turned into a thoroughly female fairy, complete with wand.

The transformation was boosted by the pantomimes that became popular in the Victorian era - and, naturally, included a good fairy in the cast.


Candles

Ancient Romans lit candle to ward off evil, and to convince the sun to shine again. In Victorian times, candles came to represent good will for those less fortunate during the holiday season. Candles were often placed in windows during the Christmas season as a sign to those passing by that shelter and warmth could be found within.

Christmas Holly

Druids believed that holly, with its shiny leaves and red berries stayed green in Winter to keep the earth beautiful when the sacred oak lost it leaves. They wore sprigs of holly in their hair when they went into the forest to watch their priests cut the sacred mistletoe. Holly was the sacred plant of Saturn and was used at the Roman Saturnalia festival to honor him. Romans gave one another holly wreaths and carried them about decorating images of Saturn with it. Centuries later, in December, while other Romans continued their pagan worship, Christians celebrated the birth of Jesus . To avoid persecution, they decked their homes with Saturnalia holly. As Christian numbers increased and their customs prevailed, holly lost its pagan association and became a symbol of Christmas.

Christmas Mistletoe

Mistletoe is an aerial parasite plant that has no roots of its own and lives off the tree it attaches itself to. Without the tree it would die. Mistletoe was thought to be sacred by ancient Europeans. Druid priests employed it in their sacrifices to the gods while Celtic people felt it possessed miraculous healing powers. In fact, in the Celtic language mistletoe means "all-heal".

Later, the eighteenth-century English credited mistletoe not with miraculous healing powers, but with a certain magical appeal called a kissing ball. At Christmas time a young woman standing under a ball of mistletoe, brightly trimmed with evergreens, ribbons, and ornaments, cannot refuse to be kissed. Such a kiss could mean deep romance or lasting friendship and goodwill. If the woman remains unkissed, she cannot expect to marry the following year. Whether we believe it or not, it is always fun at Christmas celebrations.

The Poinsettia

Dr Joel Poinsett, the country's first ambassador to Mexico, brought the fire red flower to the United States more than 100 years ago. Mexico's legend of the Poinsettia tells of a poor Mexican girl Maria and her little brother Pablo. The two children loved the annual Mexican Christmas festival with its large Manger scene, but each year they were disappointed that they had no money to buy a present for the baby Jesus.

One Christmas eve Maria and Pablo stopped to pick some weeds growing along the roadside on their way to church, to give to the baby Jesus. The other children chided them for their gift, but Maria and Pablo knew their gift was from the heart, and it was all they could give. As they began to place the weeds around the Manger, the green-top leaves miraculously turned into bright red petals. Soon the Manger was surrounded by the beautiful star-shaped flowers we love too see during the holidays.

The Christmas Tree

People often wonder where the custom of having a tree in the home during Christmas time comes from. We will probably never know for sure. But there are many historical clues that point out where this custom came from.

Thousands or years ago, there were people who believed that evergreen trees were magical. Even in winter, when all the other trees and were brown and bare, the evergreen tree stayed strong and green. People saw the evergreen as a symbol of life and as a sure sign that sunshine and spring would soon return. Candles, or the electric lights we use to decorate our trees today, are also an ancient symbol. They represent the light of spring overcoming the darkness of winter.

So when did the Christmas tree go indoors? Legend has it that the tradition was begun by Martin Luther in Germany. He was a monk and church reformer who lived from 1483 to 1546. According to the legend, Luther was returning home one wintry night when he saw the stars twinkling in the sky through the tree branches. Luther was amazed by the sight, and when he arrived home, he was eager to tell his family about it. To help them understand, he went to the woods and cut down a small fir tree. Luther brought it indoors and decorated it with candles, which represented the stars he had seen.

The custom spread in Germany, and from there all over the world. In England, the Christmas tree first appeared when Queen Victoria married Albert, a German Prince. In 1841, Albert set up a Christmas tree at Windsor Castle near London to remind him of his homeland. The Christmas tree custom was brought to the United States by people from England as well as by many German immigrants who came in the 1800's. Whatever its origin, the Christmas tree is a beautiful symbol for everyone who celebrates Christmas.

Christmas Pudding

Plum porridge - a soft, sweet mixture enriched with dried fruit, known as plums - was a luxury for Elizabethans. In the eighteenth century, this evolved into a thicker plum pudding.

One firm, Matthew Walker of Derby now makes some 16 million a year - 40 percent of the world's Christmas puddings.

Christmas Turkey

Turkeys came into England from Mexico in 1526, when Yorkshire man William Strickland bought six from American Indian traders and sold them in Bristol for two pence each.

Edward VII made eating turkey at Christmas fashionable, but it remained a luxury until the 1950's.


Advent Calendars

The Germans are thought to have initiated the custom of distributing Advent Calendars to children. These designs have changed very little and are still usually silver frosted landscapes with 24 hinged openings in Germany, and 25 hinged openings in most other countries. They are numbered with the date when they may be opened leading up to Christmas. Each little door yields a secret picture or message, or perhaps a small present.

Christmas Nativities

The Christmas crib was first popularised by St Francis of Assisi, who set up a simple manger scene at the little town of Greccio in Italy in 1224. It included a real manger and straw, a live ox and an ass, and local villagers who took the parts of Mary, Joseph and the Shepherds. The ceremony proved so popular it was repeated each year.


Advent Wreaths


Various customs are associated with Advent. One that still survives in parts of Europe, notably in Germany, is the hanging of Advent wreaths. These are rings made up of sprigs of evergreens such as holly and ivy, into which are fixed four red candles. They are hung from the middle of the ceiling and on each Sunday of Advent one candle is lit so that by Christmas all four are burning. In Britain in Victorian times, the Christmas pudding had to be made before Advent commenced. This was always on Stir-up Sunday, the last Sunday before Advent, when the pudding was solemnly stirred in an anti-clockwise direction by every member of the household before it was boiled (with silver charms or coins hidden in it) for several hours, then left to mature until Christmas Day.


__________________

Love always,

Jo

I share because I care.



Last edited by MajestyJo; 12-21-2015 at 11:18 PM.
MajestyJo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2013, 04:34 PM   #4
MajestyJo
Super Moderator
 
MajestyJo's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Hamilton, ON
Posts: 25,078
Default


A DIFFERENT CHRISTMAS POEM

Author Unknown

The embers glowed softly, and in their dim light,
I gazed round the room and I cherished the sight.
My wife was asleep, her head on my chest,
My daughter beside me, angelic in rest.

Outside the snow fell, a blanket of white,
Transforming the yard to a winter delight.
The sparkling lights in the tree I believe,
Completed the magic that was Christmas Eve.

My eyelids were heavy, my breathing was deep,
Secure and surrounded by love I would sleep.
In perfect contentment, or so it would seem,
So I slumbered, perhaps I started to dream.

The sound wasn't loud, and it wasn't too near,
But I opened my eyes when it tickled my ear.
Perhaps just a cough, I didn't quite know,
Then the sure sound of footsteps outside in the snow.

My soul gave a tremble, I struggled to hear,
And I crept to the door just to see who was near.
Standing out in the cold and the dark of the night,
A lone figure stood, his face weary and tight.

A soldier, I puzzled, some twenty years old,
Perhaps a Marine, huddled here in the cold.
Alone in the dark, he looked up and smiled,
Standing watch over me, and my wife and my child.

"What are you doing?" I asked without fear,
"Come in this moment, it's freezing out here!
Put down your pack, brush the snow from your sleeve,
You should be at home on a cold Christmas Eve!"

For barely a moment I saw his eyes shift,
Away from the cold and the snow blown in drifts.
To the window that danced with a warm fire's light.
Then he sighed and he said "Its really all right,
I'm out here by choice. I'm here every night."

"It's my duty to stand at the front of the line,
That separates you from the darkest of times.
No one had to ask or beg or implore me,
I'm proud to stand here like my fathers before me.

My Gramps died at 'Pearl on a day in December,"
Then he sighed, "That's a Christmas 'Gram always remembers."
My dad stood his watch in the jungles of 'Nam
',
And now it is my turn and so, here I am.
I've not seen my own son in more than a while,
But my wife sends me pictures, he's sure got her smile.

Then he bent and he carefully pulled from his bag,
The red, white, and blue... An American flag.
"I can live through the cold and the being alone,
Away from my family, my house and my home.
I can stand at my post through the rain and the sleet,
I can sleep in a foxhole with little to eat.
I can carry the weight of killing another,
Or lay down my life with my sister and brother.
Who stand at the front against any and all,
To ensure for all time that this flag will not fall."

"So go back inside," he said, "harbor no fright,
Your family is waiting and I'll be all right."
"But isn't there something I can do, at the least,
"Give you money," I asked, "or prepare you a feast?"
It seems all too little for all that you've done,
For being away from your wife and your son."

Then his eye welled a tear that held no regret,
"Just tell us you love us, and never forget.
To fight for our rights back at home while we're gone,
To stand your own watch, no matter how long.
For when we come home, either standing or dead,
To know you remember we fought and we bled.
Is payment enough, and with that we will trust,
That we mattered to you as you mattered to us.



Received with thanks from my friend Bette at Inspiration Plus
__________________

Love always,

Jo

I share because I care.



Last edited by MajestyJo; 12-21-2015 at 11:19 PM.
MajestyJo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2013, 09:45 PM   #5
MajestyJo
Super Moderator
 
MajestyJo's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Hamilton, ON
Posts: 25,078
Default

This was written for Thanksgiving and a little late, but I imagine it is applicable to Christmas too. Received with thanks from my friend Carey in Texas. Christmas is a time of thanksgiving too.


Dear Family,


I’m not dead yet. Thanksgiving is still important to me. If being in my Last Will and Testament is important to you, then you might consider being with me for my favourite holiday.

Dinner is at 2:00. Not 2:15. Not 2:05. Two. Arrive late and you get what’s left over.

Last year, that moron Marshall fried a turkey in one of those contraptions and practically burned the deck off the house. This year, the only peanut oil used to make the meal will be from the secret scoop of peanut butter I add to the carrot soup.

Jonathan, your last new wife was an idiot. You don’t arrive at someone’s house on Thanksgiving needing to use the oven and the stove. Honest to God, I thought you might have learned after two wives – date them longer and save us all the agony of another divorce.

Now, the house rules are slightly different this year because I have decided that 47% of you don’t know how to take care of nice things. Paper plates and red Solo cups might be bad for the environment, but I’ll be gone soon and that will be your problem to deal with.

House Rules:

1. The University of Texas no longer plays Texas A&M. The television stays off during the meal.
2. The” no cans for kids” rule still exists. We are using 2 litre bottles because your children still open a third can before finishing the first two. Parents can fill a child’s cup when it is empty. All of the cups have names on them and I’ll be paying close attention to refills.

3. Cloe, last year we were at Trudy’s house and I looked the other way when your Jell-O salad showed up. This year, if Jell-O salad comes in the front door it will go right back out the back door with the garbage. Save
yourself some time, honey. You’ve never been a good cook and you shouldn’t bring something that wiggles more than you. Buy something from the HEB bakery.
4. Grandmothers give grandchildren cookies and candy. That is a fact of life. Your children can eat healthy at your home. At my home, they can eat whatever they like as long as they finish it.
5. I cook with bacon and bacon grease. That’s nothing new.
Your being a vegetarian doesn’t change the fact that stuffing without bacon is like egg salad without eggs. Even the green bean casserole has a little bacon grease in it. That’s why it tastes so good. Not eating bacon is just not natural. And as far as being healthy… look at me. I’ve outlived almost everyone I know.
6. Salad at Thanksgiving is a waste of space.

7. I do not like cell phones. Leave them in the car.

8. I do not like video cameras. There will be 32 people here. I am sure you can capture lots of memories without the camera pointed at me.

9. Being a mother means you have to actually pay attention to the kids. I have nice things and I don’t put them away just because company is coming over. Mary, watch your kids and I’ll watch my things.

10. Rhonda, a cat that requires a shot twice a day is a cat that has lived too many lives. I think staying home to care for the cat is your way of letting me know that I have lived too many lives too. I can live with that.
Can you?

11. Words mean things. I say what I mean. Let me repeat: You don’t need to bring anything means you don’t need to bring anything. And if I did tell you to bring something, bring it in the quantity I said. Really.
This doesn’t have to be difficult.

12. Dominoes and cards are better than anything that requires a battery or an on/off switch. That was true when you were kids and it’s true now that you have kids.

13. Showing up for Thanksgiving guarantees presents at Christmas. Not showing up guarantees a card that may or may not be signed.
The election is over so I’ll watch what I say and you will do the same. If we all stick to that, we’ll have a good time. If not, I’ll still have a good time but it will be at your expense. In memory of your Grandfather, the back fridge will be filled with beer. Drink until it is gone. I prefer wine anyway. But one from each family needs to be the designated driver. I mean it really!

Love You, Grandma
__________________

Love always,

Jo

I share because I care.


MajestyJo is offline   Reply With Quote
Post New ThreadReply  

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Getting Through Christmas bluidkiti Newcomers Recovery Help and Support 0 09-02-2013 11:53 AM
Blessings - Laura Story janbear Videos and Music 0 08-27-2013 08:33 AM
Let's Put Christ Back Into Christmas bluidkiti Videos and Music 0 08-13-2013 11:56 AM
White Christmas bluidkiti Videos and Music 0 08-13-2013 11:42 AM
Blue Christmas bluidkiti Videos and Music 0 08-12-2013 08:42 AM


Click here to make a Donation

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:49 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.